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Old 11-25-04, 12:45 AM   #1
Bossbill
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Building a track car -- the hard way

I'm probably fairly well known around here as an early Mustang guy. To that end, if I build a racecar it has to be an early car, right?

So I bought this piece of shit:


I was going to hack it up and use it to mock up suspensions (I usually hang it out in the suspension area) to finish up my coil-overs.
But even if it needed floors, that was ok. You need to take out the floors in order to doing a really bitchin' job of SFCs. Plus, I wanted to raise the tunnel for future Tremec fitment.
And even if it needed quarters, that was ok. I want to put different year outer wheelhouses in it to stretch things out a bit.

So I started down the road to stripping out all goop, taking the floors and quarters out, etc. This was going to be a racecar.

But then I made a fatal error. I wandered into the garage and spied my other 65 -- a 65 fastback. I started seeing how the fastback was attached. Went back out to the coupe and did the same. Hmmmm.

Maybe you see where this was going, right? The coupe top is fastened onto the wheelhouse right where the inner and outers join. It's a clam shell, if you will. At the "join" there is a "fin". Both the fastback and coupe attach to the fin. They also join to the outer wheelhouse. The rear quarters from the beltline down are identical. Other than the rear seat bulkhead, the interior is almost indentical. Same with tailight panel, etc.

Cliff (yep our own cc.com Cliff) said he knew where a fastback top was. Yep, if you lop off the top of the fastback and put it on a coupe you have a fastback. Since the top was in Hayward and I'm in Seattle transport would be required.
"Hi, I have the top of fastback and I want to transport it," went the spiel, but damn, the freight business is odd. Sizes, classes, all sorts of weirdness. Quotes all over the place. Finally found a quote I could handle.
Cliff drove over and put this thing on a pallet -- he actually built the pallet -- and we were good to go. Thanks Cliff -- nice work.

And so it finally ended up at my doorstep.

Here is the top with the Hulk hanging out in the background.
Oh -- the name. Since it's a piece of shit and my wife wanted the next Mustang to be Grabber Green, it got a name...the Hulk. I don't name cars as a rule, but this just worked.
Note the exhaust laying on the ground near the Hulk. Ok, so I'm putting in major power for just the garage, but I digress.

Here's another view of the top and crate, complete with carrying handles!

You know what's a pisser? I have a 1200 sq ft garage and it's so full of Mustangs I can't do this work inside. Damn, Thanksgiving in Seattle is windy and rainy. Shades of Preston's carport.

After careful measuring on the front pillers, I cut those with a sawzall -- just for the hell of it, here is the A-piller section.

I used a plasma cutter and hacked off the rear.
Here is the top suspended in the air with the new top in the foreground

Here it is closer
.

After it's all off, here is a shot from the rear.

Why do all this? Putting the top on is not that big of deal. After you've done quarters a few times, putting a top on and then adding quarters is no more work.
Plus I'll have a fastback real cheap.

If you find this interesting, I'll update this thread. Heck, I should have the top on by Saturday.
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Last edited by Bossbill; 07-22-05 at 03:37 PM. Reason: add DUW
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Old 11-25-04, 12:55 AM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bossbill
If you find this interesting, I'll update this thread. Heck, I should have the top on by Saturday.
How about, if you don't update this thread, I'm coming to Seattle and taking the car from you.

I <3 early Mustangs.
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Old 11-25-04, 12:58 AM   #3
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Bill that is slick!

Now what is it about you guys in NW that makes you do these things?

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Old 11-25-04, 08:08 AM   #4
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Very Cool!!!!

You know, while you're at it, you might need to ..............

John
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Old 11-25-04, 08:32 AM   #5
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Damn, your nuts. We have had a few people ask about fastback roofs in our yard and how to do the conversions. We usually say we dont have anything available. Thats one of those things that if you have to ask how, you shouldnt try it.
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Old 11-25-04, 09:32 AM   #6
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Yeah, I'd have to agree, you are friggin nuts. After replacing all of that on the car, what is actually left that you would need? Aren't you at the point it would be easier, and better to build a tube car and then put the body parts on it? I'm not critiquing you at all, just a question. Your fab skills seem superior to mine so I thought I'd ask.
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Old 11-25-04, 11:40 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mtm68
Now what is it about you guys in NW that makes you do these things?
It must be those cold and rainy nights where we have little else to do. . .

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Luna
After replacing all of that on the car, what is actually left that you would need? Aren't you at the point it would be easier, and better to build a tube car and then put the body parts on it?
That's a fair question.
All of these things need floors and while they are out you can go all the way forward and tie into the front subframes with SFCs. Putting a Tremec in these is tough because the tunnel is so small -- so make it taller. The entire nose of this car is in good shape so I bought a couple of subframes, a firewall and a front clip.
I really need to stay with the standard architecture on this guy since I'm going to be running prototype parts on it for design and shakedown. All the standard suspension points have to be stock.
I have some ideas on making the standard structure stronger and I want to try them out.
And, of course, I just wanted to do it.

I'll leave the tube frame cars to Preston.
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Old 11-25-04, 02:17 PM   #8
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Hey, darn cool Bill! This is a great idea, in my opinion. For one, the price of a typical coupe is significantly less than that of FB, in any condition. Why take this on? My strong feeling is that it is the journey, not necessarily the destination, that is important. It so damn cool to build something and learn in the process.

Do you know what you want to do with the wheelhouses and fenders, i.e. stretching to fit big rubber? Even though my car is on hold, the SFC's are done, and I think they came out great. If you'd like some pic's, etc, drop me a line and I can send/post them. OR..... I have a set of TCP units, unused that really need to leave my garage, as well as some other goodies from them that I am not going to be needing!

Mark
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Old 11-25-04, 03:42 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mean 69
... it is the journey, not necessarily the destination, that is important.
You're right Mark ... I just came back from outside where I was making a bunch of small metal parts to replace those that got mangled during the removal phase -- their removal. Not a bad job actually, but I would have taken greater care at the jambs. I'm getting pretty good with just some hand held metal shears, a scribe and a pair of vicegrips to bend the metal! Turns out for those really small pieces into which you have to put a gradual bend this works better than a bender, which makes a sharp crease.
However, don't forget the value of this:
"Hey, cool fastback -- where did you get it?"
"I built it out of a Coupe."
"Say wha...??"

As for the SFCs you gave me shots of those a long time ago. I like 'em. I'm really partial to the Mustangs Plus underframe strengthening system. If you recall, this puppy increased the beam depth of the sills (beam adds strength to the fourth power of depth) so a little goes a long way. Plus the torque boxes it makes are all the way to the end of the sub-frame rails!
A friend at work is bugging me to get off my butt and get him more measurements of the car, as he's doing a Patran model of it.
That way we can get some definitive results prior to me doing any of this.

Before I get to carried away I need to get a SCCA rulebook and see if ITE is where I'll really end up. I may not care if I fit into any class at all as this may well just be an HPDE type car, but if I have to change only a few things from my final destination plans, I'll do that.

Quote:
Do you know what you want to do with the wheelhouses and fenders, i.e. stretching to fit big rubber?
On the rear I was going to do something really interesting. All 65-70 Mustangs share the same base platform. The sub-frames are the same distance apart front and rear, the floors all interchange, the sills are the same distance apart -- so there is a great deal of interchangability.
However the 67-up cars have different outer wheelhouses. The sheetmetal is wider as a result of this wider wheelhouse. That's how they fit the wider track rear in there, as compared to the 65/66. So I was going to source the later outer wheelhouse and try to fit the 65 quarters on to it. I may have to narrow that wheelhouse a bit to make this all work.
It should make the rear look real interesting.
As far as rules, this is a slight model year update and may well be allowed.
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Old 11-25-04, 08:07 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mean 69
Hey, darn cool Bill! This is a great idea, in my opinion. For one, the price of a typical coupe is significantly less than that of FB, in any condition. Why take this on? My strong feeling is that it is the journey, not necessarily the destination, that is important. It so damn cool to build something and learn in the process.
Great point! Don't take my questions as negative. I'm looking forward to watching the process and the progress. I ran against a car at Road America that was a tube chassis GT-1 car but with fast back body work on it. It looked great! Fortunately for me, looks aren't everything. That's why I brought it up. Best of luck to you and have a great time doing it.
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Old 11-25-04, 09:37 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Luna
Great point! Don't take my questions as negative. I'm looking forward to watching the process and the progress. I ran against a car at Road America that was a tube chassis GT-1 car but with fast back body work on it. It looked great! Fortunately for me, looks aren't everything. That's why I brought it up. Best of luck to you and have a great time doing it.
Thanks Mark. I have a wife telling me I'm nuts and understand how 'out there' this is. I could have taken a real rust bucket Shelby and restored it for the amount of work I've got (or will have) into this.
But building racecars makes no fiscal sense anyway, so I leave it at that.
I'm busy Friday, but by Saturday the new top should be on. Just a test fit. It will look like I did something, but the real work lays ahead ...
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Old 11-26-04, 12:50 AM   #12
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I saw Cliff a few days ago and he said that you were working on something pretty wild. I am impressed so far.
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Old 11-26-04, 01:44 AM   #13
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My cousin and I always thought it could probably be possible to build a vintage mustang entirely from new/repro parts. I've looked in mustangs plus and other catalogs that sell replacement parts for these cars and it seems as though just about every piece of sheetmetal is available so that you could put together your own car. Of course, the one piece that is frequently damaged, the front lower strut mount, is the one that I have not seen available. Personally I am still waiting for the "body in white" '67 mustang that was mentioned in hot rod to be built by a company that is producing the '69 camaro convertable tub. I can't remember the website. I think this would be a cool project and save a lot of mess starting with a new tub.
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Old 11-26-04, 05:26 PM   #14
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Neat project, Bill! Sounds like a lot of fun!

I'm not sure I understand what you'll be doing with the wheelhouses, but I look forward to seeing the results.
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Old 11-26-04, 05:35 PM   #15
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You know what's really cool? You can build a nice cage for that thing much easier now that the pesky roof isn't in the way!!!!!!!

Now I'm jealous....

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Old 11-26-04, 09:55 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trackboss
the one piece that is frequently damaged, the front lower strut mount, is the one that I have not seen available.
You mean this piece?

Heck, if I wanted a tube-frame Mustang and a body to place on that I would buy this:



As for putting in a cage with the roof off, I thought of that, but I need the roof on to give this flexy flyer some rigidity before a cage goes in it.
[edit -- last sentence sucked]
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Old 11-26-04, 10:21 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hack

I'm not sure I understand what you'll be doing with the wheelhouses, but I look forward to seeing the results.
It's really quite easy. The 65 Mustang rear diff is 57.25 inches wide. The 67 up diff is 59.25 inches wide. Since the frame is the same width and the general structure of the car through the sill is the same, where did the extra width come from? It came by making the rear quarters flare out more, by 1" per side:

65 or right, 67 on left.
The entire extra width came from a deeper outer wheelhouse:
Here is one:


The plan is to use the deeper outer 67 wheelhouse on the 65. Tthis will stretch the sheetmetal out, but not give it anymore lip.
How much width can be accomodated remains to be seen. I may have to cut the width of the 67 down, but I will stretch the width out...
If the local vintage Mustang store is open on Saturday I'll go down and buy the inners and outers.

Late tonight I did get the neighbor to come out and we placed the fb top on the car. I did a little fitting and grinding and it's on there.
Damn, it's now a fastback! The difference in the look is amazing.
Tomorrow I'll do some pics.
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Old 11-27-04, 03:13 AM   #18
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Thumbs up Guilty

Guilty as changed!! I put Boss up to it .

Cover your ear holes when welding up side down. Fuck a hot one in the ear drum and thing get really quit.

Iím losing it Bill, need handed on things can you send me one or two off the crate.

Dann Bill, tock you less time to put the top on then it tock me the build the crate.

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Old 11-27-04, 10:08 AM   #19
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Quote:
If you find this interesting, I'll update this thread.
I sure do, so keep us posted!
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Old 11-27-04, 03:13 PM   #20
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Bill,
Great project! Yes, please keep the pictures coming.
I saw a 66 at a local car show with 70 rear fenders and 315's and it looked great. Didn't pay much attention to details as I was trying to see how they got 315's under the front fenders. (The fenders were stretched from the headlight buckets to the doors. Almost looked stock.)
Would you please send me the I D dimensions of the A-pillar as shown in "here is the A-pillar section." I'm trying to find a square tube that will fit inside the A-pillar, but have measured the OD on 3 cars and gotten 3 different dimensions. Love those tolerences. I'm thinking of a "hidden" roll cage.
The bodies you showed, are they glass or metal (they look F/G) and who's offering them?
Thanks and keep warm,
Ex-Washingtonian,
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Old 11-27-04, 10:59 PM   #21
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John -- Forgot to measure but I'll do that tomorrrow. I noticed that there are some wild variances in the two A-Pillers. When I line up the contour on the outside, the inside doesn't match. It appears that the inside welded piece can and did move around when they welded this thing together. From what I've read only the main floor pan was welded by a robot-type machine. The rest of the car was all hand welded and certain pieces didn't always fit too well. I have an 65 assembly line pic of two guys welding the interior and one is welding the pinch seam at the top of the windshield with a handheld tong welder hooked to some large cables.

The one piece fiberglass body is from http://www.usbodysource.com

MAS Racing Products has a one piece glass tilt nose
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Old 11-29-04, 09:20 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bossbill
Before I get to carried away I need to get a SCCA rulebook and see if ITE is where I'll really end up. I may not care if I fit into any class at all as this may well just be an HPDE type car,
Great post. I hoped to see the picture this am. Do you think the car would be competitive in ITE? What about vintage?

You can shorten the rear axle housing to get a wider tire on the rear of the 65/66.
Doc
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Old 11-29-04, 12:08 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 95cobraR
... I hoped to see the picture this am. Do you think the car would be competitive in ITE? What about vintage?

You can shorten the rear axle housing to get a wider tire on the rear of the 65/66.
Doc
Doc -- I had hoped to download it as well, but Saturday I ended up going to Bel-kirk Mustang and bought the trunk floors, inner and outer (67 here) wheelhouses and quarter skins. The rest of the day we were finishing wiring at the Arboretum, where I volunteer.
On Sunday I vice-gripped the quarters on and it looks pretty good. I think the 67 outer will work. It really bulges out the sides...cool. I snapped some pics but I've had no time at all to download as my wife had me under strict geek-watch (she's keeps me from geeking out too far on car stuff and wants some face time).
Then my nephew (bodyman) came over to remind me that I needed to hang the doors in order to get the body line right at the quarters. To do that I need to media blast the guts, as I've already de-skinned them. Then we skin and hang. Then I can finally hang the quarters.

I'm pretty sure Vintage is out as they won't allow coilovers and my other mods.
ITE is just a big bucket in which I will not be competitive -- I don't think -- but I need to order the GCR and see what's up before I start cutting any metal for cages and SFCs.

As for the shorter axle, I will probably run the Versailles housing (but no other Versailles pieces) into which I have some major money (including alloy axles).
I'll have to run some special wheels to get all that rubber under the covers.

[edit for a bit more clarity]
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Old 11-29-04, 12:16 PM   #24
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You'll also need to make sure you can run in ITE in your Division. The rules vary, and they've changed in most regions. At one point it was a true catch-all, and recently they've changed it (here in Texas, at least) to be only cars homologated (or run) in some sort of series or class that isn't in existence. The "new" catchall for us is SP (Super Production), which has everything from Supra's, GAC Audi's, Baby Grands, on down. I'm not aware of anybody that actually "campaigns" ITE or SP cars, so if you go to most of the races, you've got a good chance of doing well in the points. I can't speak for whether or not you'll have cars to race with, though I suspect you're not as worried about that. ;l)
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Old 11-29-04, 01:40 PM   #25
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You can always run it in American Iron. The new 2005 rules are posted

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Old 11-29-04, 03:51 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pederb
You can always run it in American Iron.
If they had some venues up here and I'd go for it.
We need AIX PNW (Pacific NorthWest for you California guys)!
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Old 11-29-04, 03:56 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pederb
You can always run it in American Iron.
Bill,
Vintage cars are great here. You can run vintage (HSR doesn't require period correct & SVRA does), NASA AIX, O/T, SCCA vintage, and AV8SS. Please keep us posted. I'd like to see how it comes along. I just added up the schedules for next year and found 35 available weekend events.

Peder,
Beautiful #13 car. I think it is the first 65/66 I've seen with Cobra R wheels. Do you have a link to your car specs?

Doc
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Edit: sp

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Old 11-29-04, 05:05 PM   #28
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Holy Crap, Peder. That's a hell of a winged beast.
Your home page is not active, however.
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Old 11-29-04, 05:11 PM   #29
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Bill, why don't you start a PNW section of NASA?

Sorry I don't have much info on Guy Dreier's 65 AI/X it's very fast and the 2004 AI/X runner up.

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Old 11-29-04, 07:00 PM   #30
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He build a C/O on the UCA

Bill is the car I was telling you about. He made a C/O on the UCA. It a fast one


Bill, I got a duel master brake cylinder set up from John and they work real well. Not a lot of pedal effort.

http://www.johnsmustangs.com/brakes.shtml

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Old 11-29-04, 11:12 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Cochran
Would you please send me the I D dimensions of the A-pillar as shown in "here is the A-pillar section."
John -- As an ex-Washingtonian you'll appreciate the fact that it's raining tonight! 32 deg last night, but raining tonight.

The piece I cut off of the FB roof can fit a 1.25 round tube. Square is more interesting as it's not real square in there (of course) and I see a 1.125 square tube fitting.
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Old 11-29-04, 11:51 PM   #32
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More pictures...
After I took the coupe roof off, the inner wheelhouse (w/h) had to go. It's not a requirement of the conversion, but mine was rusty at the bottom edge, where the w/h meets the floor.
On other cars I've rescued them by welding in patches at the bottom, but I thought I'd try a new w/h, instead.
Here I've removed the inner w/h and all you see is floor and sub-frame. People think I'm a bit daft to go this far down, but I'm finally to a solid piece now and can reinforce the structure. There is so much one can access at this point.

What looks like real rust is just minor surface rust. The real rust is on the ground and in the trash..

About 8" to the rear of the roller stand post you can see the 'C' shaped part of the f/b roof that joins to the inner w/h.
Above and forward is the w/h fins attachment point on the roof -- here it's pretty jagged. Just inward is the last w/h attachment point which rests on the w/h as well.
If you get the idea the w/h is the major attachment point on this roof and the coupe, you're right.
The last minor attachment is where the trap door attachment points are. You can see them resting on the rear sub-frames.

As we pan out, you can finally see the top resting on the Hulk. I have a trunk floor piece hanging out the rear, just for fitment.

Finally, here is a bit of showmanship. Don't get the idea I'm anywhere near this stage. But, when you throw on a major piece of exterior tin, it looks like a car again.
Here is the Hulk FastCoupe as it will look many weeks from now .
See, if I pan out and don't show the two vicegrips holding the skin on I can make you believe in magic.
[edit--found a better pic]
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Old 11-29-04, 11:54 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cliff yates
Bill, I got a dual master brake cylinder set up from John and they work real well. Not a lot of pedal effort.
Cliff, I have the source catalog where John bought them.
We do like finding the original manufacturer, don't we?

[edit remove verbal verbosity)
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Old 11-30-04, 12:06 AM   #34
cliff yates
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bossbill
Cliff, I have the source catalog where John bought them.
We do like like finding the original manufacturer, don't we?
CNC
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Old 11-30-04, 12:19 AM   #35
cliff yates
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Bill the Hulk personifies the word resurrection! Did I spell it right?
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Old 11-30-04, 05:30 PM   #36
Preston
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Now you're building it right !!

I remember looking at stuff like this and finding it unbelievable. Now, I can't imagine building a car any other way. Any future project of mine will start with a full sandblast and complete chassis teardown.

I mounted new quarters to my roof and all that, and what you are doing just looks like par for the course to me. I'm like, yup, yup, that attachment point, etc.

Are you planning on spot welding or seam welding for the most part ?

I never really thought about a fastback roof before. I'd always liked the coupe, thought they had more of a "musclecar" look, a little more "working man" look if you know what I mean, but funny we always change, now I like fastbacks better, primarily cuz of the aero I bet. I've been following Rad Ride's lately, and their build style is my current obsession.

Bossbill you are located up north somewhere ? I should come over for a visit as soon as the car is running again (just finishing up on my new twin turbo install, ran the engine last night, just buttoning up some engine compartment detailing before I road test it.

I am absolutely obsessed with cars in build. I don't know why I just lose it when I see bodies in bare metal like the aforementioned Rad Rides buildup. I barely even look at pictures of finished painted cars anymore ha ha. I've said it before, sheet metal is boring. If something ever happened to my Stang I think my next car would be some kind of street rod inspired racecar, with as many mechanicals as possible on view, and big fat stickies hanging out at all 4 corners. Either that or a total sedan street rod style meant for daily driving. Or...bla bla bla

Anyway I'm rambling. Excellent project, although I'm no fan of sticking with the stock suspension pickups. Somebody just came out with a nice 4 link/panhard/coilover for these cars that works with the original rear frame rail, I don't know if that's legal for AIX. My personal opinion nowadays after thinking all the variables over is that the FatMan strut conversion for the front end is the best solution for using the stock pickup points, but I know you've got your own deal going there.

BTW for those thinking about it, I contemplated the fiberglass fastback body shown above but the manu said you'd have to use lexan windows and fiberglass doors so I gave that up. I wouldn't mind getting one of those one piece front ends if I could figure out how to get a version of my flares attached to it
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Old 12-01-04, 01:46 AM   #37
Red Barchetta
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bossbill
Cliff, I have the source catalog where John bought them.
We do like finding the original manufacturer, don't we?
Quote:
Originally Posted by cliff yates
CNC
I know this is more of a suspension forum question, but since it was brought up in this thread, does anyone have any experience with CNC Brakes? I know TCP used them on their race car with great results. As far as I know, John's Mustangs (or JMC Motorsports, whichever name you want to use) is the only one I know of that sells kits for early Mustangs.

Here's a photo of what I'm looking at:



6 piston billet calipers with 13" rotors, billet aluminum hubs...drool. Everyone talks about Baer, StopTech, Wilwood, etc. I just wanted to see if anyone has experience with these bad boys.

A search for "CNC Brakes" is either too broad or too limiting.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Mvc-006s.jpg (27.7 KB, 3358 views)

Last edited by Red Barchetta; 12-01-04 at 04:11 PM. Reason: stupid other forum doesn't like leeching
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Old 12-01-04, 11:51 AM   #38
Bossbill
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Preston
Now you're building it right !!

I remember looking at stuff like this and finding it unbelievable. Now, I can't imagine building a car any other way. Any future project of mine will start with a full sandblast and complete chassis teardown.
I thought that too. But if you count the welds holding this quarter on, it's not that bad. It looks worse than it is.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Preston
Are you planning on spot welding or seam welding for the most part ?
I will spot (or plug) weld the pieces just like stock, then put it on the rotisserie after the media blast and weld all the seams.

As for the quarter join, I'll butt-weld. I used to do panel flanging and then welded the join. That works and is a good way to get the panels to line up because you can use screws to hold it together. But after my welding classes I see the butt weld as offering better pentration and I don't have a seam in which moisture can hide.
I actually think the butt weld is easier to finish, since I haven't distorted the metal with the flange. Gotta keep the heat down though.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Preston
I never really thought about a fastback roof before.
I own nothing but fastbacks and being a Shelby kind-o-guy the fastback was in my blood well before anything else. I really like the 67 TransAm coupes, though.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Preston
Bossbill you are located up north somewhere ? I should come over for a visit as soon as the car is running again (just finishing up on my new twin turbo install, ran the engine last night, just buttoning up some engine compartment detailing before I road test it.
I'm close the the junction of 18 and Maple Valley Highway.
I'm having a loooong ditch dug to handle the new power to the shop, so things are really messy right now. I'll PM you with my address, etc.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Preston
I am absolutely obsessed with cars in build. I don't know why I just lose it when I see bodies in bare metal like the aforementioned Rad Rides buildup.
I must be too as this project holds more fascination than my other two. My bodyman is intrigued too. We're going to remove the drip rails and do a general smooth job on this puppy. The cowl gets blended, door window openings removed, one wiper goes, the dash will be one contiguous original looking piece.
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Old 12-01-04, 12:03 PM   #39
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I've also heard that flanging can be seen through the paint as the double thickness expands at a different rate in heat. In general it seems like a bad idea, butt welding much better.

When I attached my quarter, after I melted the lead out of the sail panel, there was step there anyway, so I Just flat welded it and then had to fill the "ditch" with all-metal and body finish it anyway, not sure looking at your roof if there is any lead at the join line, there definitely was on my coupe.

When butt welding in patch panels, it can be tough to keep the heat out with MIG, I'm sure TIG is much better way to go, very easy to lose patience and warp the panel, and I still haven't really learned to work with hammers and dollies.

I'm good at the rough fabrication, but I still really suck at "finishing" things and cosmetics.

I kind of wish I'd removed the drip rails now, but at the time I'm like "well I don't want rain coming down when I open the door" like I'm gonna drive it in the rain anyway.

Thumbing through that RadRides site makes me want to do more metal/bodywork though. I contemplated making my side scoops out of body metal instaed of the bolt on fiberglass shelby scoop, but couldn't afford to dink around at that poit in the project.
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Old 12-01-04, 03:11 PM   #40
Bossbill
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The thing about coupes is that you can buy a repop coupe quarter. You cannot do so for a fastback. So while you did a join where Ford did, I cannot.
I'll end up using a coupe skin and the join will be 1" in from the beltline breakover. Right in the valley at the top of the fender. An NOS fastback quarter is around $1500 a side!
I'll use a Mig, but the key to keeping heat down is to do just spot welds. After you do one spot weld in the front you move over to the rear and do another one there.
The idea is to never allow the metal to get hot by welding in one area.

I'm getting serious enough that I want a 48" bender and a bead roller. Now I'm thinking of building another carport close to the house for the cars (I hate garages for parking in since I always end up using them for project cars, plus I dislike the doors) and framing the present carport in as a metal shop! God it just never ends.

On another post in this section I was thinking about using the cowl for fresh air. After being told the error in my ways I'm now thinking about using a 67 Shelby scoop in the sail panel as a way to get fresh air to my helmet. Hmmm, then again a little fire up front and I'd be sniffing the nasties again. I might be back to using the headlight bucket as my fresh air intake...
[edit -- how about we spell about]
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